Genesis 22: 17 Commentary

SCOTT DALE:

THAT IS PERFECTLY FINE.

AND YES; I am ANGEL.

But for your information I do not belong to any denominational church which is of their Mother in Revelation 17.

For I am a TRUE MESSAGE BELIEVER OF THIS VERY HOUR.

By 2live4GOD (wrote 400 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/31/2012 22:38 pm

Post #5

I’m afraid your answer simply doesn’t wash. You have so spiritualized the text as to rob it of any practical meaning to Abraham; not to mention the exegesis itself. The original discussion regarding “pre-destination/determination” has simply been nullified because of your interpretation.

It’s very plain that we come from entirely different “universes” and there will seldom be foundational agreement. I suspected this from the start based on your modalistic mixed-bag view of the nature of God, and this discussion as well as Eph. 1:14 confirms it. Discussing pre-destination with a staunch Calvinist is perhaps one of the most frustrating theological exercises there is; and that’s with someone who AGREES with the Trinity doctrine. It is unimaginable to me how frustrating discussions such as this will be with someone who does NOT agree with the Trinity doctrine. In other words; I’m not interested in continuing.

By Scott Dale (wrote 581 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/31/2012 18:01 pm

SCOTT DALE:

YOU STATED: The original point is that in 22:16 God swears by His own NAME (authority) that He will give Abraham multitudes for descendents and that they WILL possess the gate of their enemies.

This is a FOUNDATIONAL verse that says God will bring the descendents of Abraham into the Land that He promised ON OATH; so if ever a verse were an example of God’s pre-destinating power, this ought to have been it. However; there were nearly as many who DID NOT enter the Land as there were who did. They all escaped the Judgments of God by the blood of the lamb in Egypt but not all entered into their Inheritance to “possess the gate of their enemy”. Why not? Were they not all pre-destined to do so or did God lie to Abraham?

MY ANSWER: This verse was speaking of my Lord Jesus Christ and not of Isaac or the descendants of Abraham. For only my Lord Jesus Christ has possessed the gates of our enemies at Calvary and through him so have we.

And as for the Exodus it is a shadow of today how it shall be. Only the Bride shall cross into that promised Heavenly Kingdom which kept GOD’S TRUTH of ALL his HOLY WORD and this is the New Heavens and the others will live outside of this Heavenly Kingdom on the New Earth who mixed GOD’S TRUTH with dogmas.

By 2live4GOD (wrote 400 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/28/2012 19:20 pm

Post #3

Your response makes absolutely no sense to me. What I mean is that I have no idea what you are talking about. To simply answer my question should not take such a long and complex dissertation.

The original point is that in 22:16 God swears by His own NAME (authority) that He will give Abraham multitudes for descendents and that they WILL possess the gate of their enemies.

This is a FOUNDATIONAL verse that says God will bring the descendents of Abraham into the Land that He promised ON OATH; so if ever a verse were an example of God’s pre-destinating power, this ought to have been it. However; there were nearly as many who DID NOT enter the Land as there were who did. They all escaped the Judgments of God by the blood of the lamb in Egypt but not all entered into their Inheritance to “possess the gate of their enemy”. Why not? Were they not all pre-destined to do so or did God lie to Abraham?

By Scott Dale (wrote 581 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/26/2012 21:37 pm

SCOTT DALE:

YOU POSTED IN REVELATION 17:8 about PREDESTINED:
1. According to your interpretation, God lied to Abraham in Gen. 22:17. Would you care to explain THAT?

2. But I am curious why you have avoided addressing Genesis 22:17. Do you not see that this promise is the OT type of the NT reality we are discussing? The differences between justification and inheritance are very wide and there is a certain pre-destination and pre-determination regarding everyone who attains them. But the distinctions of these (doctrinal) differences can only be understood with any measure of certainty from the OT narrative beginning with Abraham’s call and culminating with the crossing and conquest of Canaan.

MY ANSWER: To me PREDESTINED according to GOD’S HOLY WORD in the Book Of Ephesians states quite clearly that GOD has chosen his PREDESTINED BRIDE before the very foundations. So therefore; before the very foundations; there was ONLY GOD in his HOLY SPIRIT FORM.

So then we can say beyond a shadow of doubt that GOD has ALREADY chosen his PREDESTINED BRIDE and those to condemnation.

Also it is my belief then if GOD has PREDESTINED his BRIDE then we are GOD’S true Sons and Daughters since the separation of the Logos which was my Lord Jesus Christ and the Bride.

For Instance if we were to look at Genesis 1:2 which states ” And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters ” so here we can also state that this is were GOD’S glory shined forth from the darkness and moved upon the waters; the Logos; being the very Spirit of GOD. And the Logos was my Lord Jesus Christ and the true Sons and Daughters of GOD in Spirit Form shining from and in GOD’S GLORY ALREADY GLORIFIED.

One must also question what was this Spirit of GOD moving about upon the waters. And we discover that the Logos is GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD. for the Logos is all that was, that is, and that shall be before the very foundations.

In other words; the Logos is the pure essence and the pure word of GOD that came forth from GOD and is a part of GOD in every essence; and within this pure essence and pure word of GOD came forth our LORD JESUS CHRIST and every true Son and Daughter of GOD before the very foundations.

For this is were GOD our Father, which is a Spirit Form of GOD, and also the same GOD in us, and then there is GOD’S only begotten Son who also came forth from the Logos of GOD creating the Sonship of GOD along with every true Son and Daughter of GOD.

This is GOD in three different offices/roles/titles/positions; and not three coequal individuals as trinitarians believe. GOD is not a unitarian; for our LORD JESUS CHRIST cannot be his own father. GOD is also not a binitarian as well; for our LORD JESUS CHRIST is a man indwelled with GOD, not two equal GODS.

GOD/ LORD/ GOD in heaven
GOD/ JESUS/ GOD on earth; in a 100% man ( JESUS CHRIST ) indwelled with 100% GOD; as prophesied
GOD/ CHRIST/ GOD in us; HOLY SPIRIT

Also contained in that Logos of GOD was the Holy Bible already fulfilled and glorified. It just had to be manifested and played out on Earth.

For the Logos is the very word of GOD that first was a thought, then that thought became a spoken word of GOD, and then that spoken word of GOD became manifested. so the word of GOD is eternal and just as the Holy Bible states is going to remain when all else to destroyed.

Also if the Logos is the pure essence and word of GOD and is eternal; then; the true Sons and Daughters of GOD have always been eternal and we have always been a part of GOD’S manifesting word before the very foundations as to also being a part of every event that occurred throughout the Holy Bible. For the pure essence and word of GOD is one body, one mind, and one word always producing and manifesting.

So in other words; the Logos; has been moving throughout the Holy Bible producing and manifesting the true Sons and Daughters of GOD at its appropriate time from the Logos of GOD and has always been a part of GOD’S works and will before the very foundations of GOD; for we have always been a part of the Spirit of GOD moving throughout the Holy Bible.

So therefore as for Abraham we see it is the same PREDESTINED SEED that was to receive the blessings GOD was PROMISING MAN for salvation and that also GOD was going to also bless Abraham in many ways as well… and since man had failed GOD in every way then GOD himself had to make a new Covenant unto himself and Abraham was the witness to all of this of a future Son of GOD to be born from a virgin and then to be slaughtered as a lamb lead to the slaughterhouse.

But GOD told Abraham this Royal Seed shall come through him and Sarah. And it all starts with the birth Isaac.

So you see it is still PREDESTINED by GOD himself before the very foundations. This is GOD’S will and story of Redemption.

By 2live4GOD (wrote 400 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/26/2012 21:00 pm

THE MODERN DESCENDANTS OF JACOB ARE LOSING THE GATES & STRATEGIC PASSES BECAUSE OF THEIR SINS!

Changing of the Guard
From the Sample Issue 2007 Trumpet Print Edition »
The decline of U.S.-British control over the world’s sea gates BY STEPHEN FLURRY
source: http://www.thetrumpet.com/?q=3149.0.90.0

You’re sitting inside a fenced courtyard where all the gates are locked. At each gate stands an armed guard who will not allow you to leave. You are where?

The correct answer is prison.

Now imagine those burly guards laying down their weapons and handing over their keys to the inmates. That’s essentially what the United States and Britain have done. Prior to World War ii, they controlled every major sea gate in the world. These “gates,” as they are called in the Bible, proved indispensable to Allied success during World War ii. Since that time, however, the U.S. and Britain have, without a fight, surrendered their control as gatekeepers.

By TIUCHE (wrote 3264 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 12/31/2011 08:21 am

On another post, TIUCHE asked me which nation I think this verse is in reference to.

TIUCHE, it is not in reference to any particular nation. Read the next verse, 22:18 “And in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed; because thou hast obeyed my voice”.

So, TIUCHE, a question for you. Do you think this prophecy by God came true? Do you think the aborigines of Australia and the Java man of Indonesia and the Inka of Peru re all descended from Abraham? And do you think that Americans, North Koreans, Muslims, and all other people of all nations are living in peaceful blessedness?

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/18/2011 16:06 pm