Genesis 3: 6 Commentary

Okay, Angel, hugs to you.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/28/2011 01:45 am

charles:
we may never see eye to eye but know this. We are on a journey to the heavenly kingdom and if we see each other there I will give you a hug for we are brothers in our LORD JESUS CHRIST…. GOD BLESS YOU ALWAYS CHARLES….

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/28/2011 01:37 am

Dear Angel (post 39)

Isaiah 7:14 talks about a ‘virgin’ (or a ‘young woman’, depending on the translation you read). There are millions of virgins and millions of young women. Isaiah doesn’t give any names, so it could be anybody. Could be my spinster great aunt, for all you know!

He only gives a name for the child, and it’s Immanuel, not Jesus. These two names are NOT the same. Immanuel means ‘God be with us’ while Jesus means ‘Savior’. So he’s obviously NOT talking about Jesus, is he? If he was talking about Jesus why would he say Immanuel?

Daniel 9:25-26. Messiah is an Old Testament word. It meant a king like David - one who would lead the people of Israel against their enemies. The messiah of the O.T. was a winner of wars. On the contrary Jesus made it very clear that he was not talking about an earthly kingdom. He taught peace, not war.

Now I know that the N.T. tries to make Jesus the messiah, but Jesus himself NEVER claimed that title. Daniel did not say that Jesus was the messiah and Jesus did NOT say he was the messiah either; so why would I believe anybody else?

Habbakuk 2:14. Again, Habbakuk talks about the Lord, which meant God (Yahweh) in the O.T. Did Habbakuk mention Jesus? No, of course not!

All your other quotations are from the New Testament, so I am not going to comment about those. We both know that the N.T. claims that the prophets were talking about Jesus but, as I have again showed you, there is absolutely not one iota of verification of this in the OT. Nothing. Nada. Zilch.

Did you know that Moslems also insist that the O.T. prophets were talking about Muhammad? Well, it’s true. They paste their arguments online too. But they are just as wrong.

FACT: The O.T. does not once mention Muhammad OR Jesus.

Take care.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/27/2011 23:58 pm

Tiuche, use new kid on the block angel fraijo as a model how a Christian can communicate with Charles without calling him names. We all can learn form each other, right?
A regular visitor.

By Chris (wrote 1 Bible Commentary - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/27/2011 21:30 pm

charles:
Sorry was a little busy. Anyways hope all is well with you. On with the WORD OF GOD. Now you said JESUS CHRIST/THE MESSIAH/EMMANUEL are never mentioned in the old testament but i will show you scriptures on this false assumption that JESUS was never mentioned in old testament. Now I could start with isaiah scripture 7:14

Isaiah 7:14
14 Therefore the Lord himself shall give you a sign; Behold, a virgin shall conceive, and bear a son, and shall call his name Immanuel.

But I know you will say ” NO…NO…NO… that could be any IMMANUEL/EMMANUEL and besides they are spelled differently. ” Even though a virgin did conceive… Mary ( mother of JESUS. ) Which is stated in matthew 1:18,22-23

Matthew 1:18
18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When as his mother Mary was espoused to Joseph, before they came together, she was found with child of the Holy Ghost.

Matthew 1:22-23
22 Now all this was done, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken of the Lord by the prophet, saying,
23 Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.

But now we are an educated race understanding more of the bible and realize there is only one MESSIAH/MESSIAS and it is mentioned throughout the new testament. For MESSIAH MEANS CHRIST. Which also means THE ANOINTED ONE. We know this and so does every church throughout the world. EVEN YOUR CHURCH. MESSIAH relates only to JESUS CHRIST. And yes they are spelled different because one is written in hebrew while the other is written in greek. Same with the names pertaining to Emmanuel. Now notice in daniel 9:25-26

Daniel 9:25-26
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.
26 And after threescore and two weeks shall Messiah be cut off, but not for himself: and the people of the prince that shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and the end thereof shall be with a flood, and unto the end of the war desolations are determined.

Notice the word Messiah. Now read john 1:41 and matthew 1:16.

John 1:41
41 He first findeth his own brother Simon, and saith unto him, We have found the Messias, which is, being interpreted, the Christ.

Matthew 1
16 and Jacob begat Joseph the husband of Mary, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.

Now also you say the genealogy of matthew 1:1-17 and luke 3:23-38 are different. Well they better be different because in matthew it is for joseph and the one in luke is for mary. YES…YES…YES… I know you don’t see it and it does not say that. Well lets see what it says.

Matthew 1:1, 15-17
1 The book of the generation of JESUS CHRIST, the son of david, the son of abraham.

Matthew 1:15-17
15 And Eliud begat Eleazar; and Eleazar begat Matthan; and Matthan begat Jacob;
16 AND JACOB BEGAT JOSEPH THE HUSBAND OF MARY, of whom was born Jesus, who is called Christ.
17 So all the generations from Abraham to David are fourteen generations; and from David until the carrying away into Babylon are fourteen generations; and from the carrying away into Babylon unto Christ are fourteen generations.

You see it now. This was for JOSEPH. The reason it starts with abraham is because JESUS is the SON OF GOD. For joseph is JESUS adopted father, and joseph is a seed from abraham as promised from GOD, and because also the angel gabriel told joseph mary is pregnant with JESUS by the HOLY GHOST. Plus Joseph lineage comes from solomon’s lineage. You know the son of david as stated in luke 2:4. Where as Mary is a seed from nathan; you know solomon’s brother. The other son from david. Now I know what your going to say NO IT DOESN”T SAY THAT. Answer yourself this then if every person shall be taxed according to luke 2:1-5 then why didn’t mary go to were she was born/registered to pay her taxes. Because her and joseph weren’t married yet. I know were does it say that. In like 2:5 as posted below. For she too was from the house of david which is stated in luke 3:31. Says it right there.

Luke 2:5
5 To be taxed with Mary his espoused wife, being great with child. ( Now espoused means engaged/betrothed/promised to ) So they weren’t married yet. so this should of been two different journey’s for their taxing.

Here is also the two different genealogies showing from matthew 1:6 of joseph and of mary from luke 3:31. Showing from king david’s two sons ( solomon and nathan ) were joseph’s lineage comes from; to were mary’s lineage comes from.

THIS IS FROM JOSEPH GENEALOGY STEMMING FROM SOLOMON ( DAVID’S SON )
Matthew 1:6
6 And Jesse begat David the king; and David begat Solomon of her that had been the wife of Urias; ( and from here all the way to jacob; jacob begat joseph husband of mary as stated in matthew 1:16)

THIS IS MARY GENEALOGY STEMMING FROM NATHAN ( DAVID’S SON )
Luke 3:31
31 Which was the son of Melea, which was the son of Menan, which was the son of Mattatha, which was the son of Nathan, which was the son of David, (

I PRAY THIS IS A BLESSING TO ALL WHO READ THIS AND HAVE THEIR QUESTION ANSWERED WHY THE GENEALOGIES WERE DIFFERENT FROM MATTHEW AND LUKE. SO YOU SEE THE BIBLE DOES NOT CONTRADICT ITSELF AND THIS GENEALOGY HAS BEEN PROVEN AS THUS STATED HERE.

FOR AS HABAKKUK 2:14 STATES ” FOR THE EARTH SHALL BE FILLED WITH THE KNOWLEDGE OF THE GLORY OF THE LORD, AS THE WATERS COVER THE SEA. ”

AND FOR ME PERSONALLY PAUL STATES THIS THE BEST IN 1 CORINTHIANS 1:1-9/17-31 AND 2:1-16. AS POSTED BELOW. FOR IT STATES THAT KNOWLEDGE OF MAN IS NOTHING COMPARED TO THE POWER OF GOD DEMONSTRATED THROUGH US FOR OTHERS TO SEE AND KNOW THERE IS A GOD. FOR THE WISDOM OF MAN IS NOTHING UNLESS YOU ARE BORN AGAIN THROUGH THE HOLY BLOOD SPILLED BY JESUS CHRIST AT CALVARY AND TO BE ABLE TO RECEIVE THE KNOWLEDGE, WISDOM, AND UNDERSTANDING OF GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD FROM JESUS CHRIST. ENJOY AND GOD BLESS YOU ALWAYS……

1 Corinthians 1:1-9
1 Paul called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God, and Sosthenes our brother,
2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both their’s and our’s:
3 Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ.
4 I thank my God always on your behalf, for the grace of God which is given you by Jesus Christ;
5 That in every thing ye are enriched by him, in all utterance, and in all knowledge;
6 Even as the testimony of Christ was confirmed in you:
7 So that ye come behind in no gift; waiting for the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ:
8 Who shall also confirm you unto the end, that ye may be blameless in the day of our Lord Jesus Christ.
9 God is faithful, by whom ye were called unto the fellowship of his Son Jesus Christ our Lord.

1 Corinthians 1:17-31
17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect.
18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God.
19 For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent.
20 Where is the wise? where is the scribe? where is the disputer of this world? hath not God made foolish the wisdom of this world?
21 For after that in the wisdom of God the world by wisdom knew not God, it pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe.
22 For the Jews require a sign, and the Greeks seek after wisdom:
23 But we preach Christ crucified, unto the Jews a stumblingblock, and unto the Greeks foolishness;
24 But unto them which are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God, and the wisdom of God.
25 Because the foolishness of God is wiser than men; and the weakness of God is stronger than men.
26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:
27 But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;
28 And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to nought things that are:
29 That no flesh should glory in his presence.
30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

1 Corinthians 2:1-16
1 And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.
2 For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified.
3 And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.
4 And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man’s wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5 That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God.
6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7 But we speak the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory:
8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
9 But as it is written, Eye hath not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God hath prepared for them that love him.
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.
12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man’s wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.
16 For who hath known the mind of

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/27/2011 20:30 pm

Angel (post 37), we’ve gone around this three times already. Paul, Luke and John made a conscious effort to put Jesus in the OT. So did Moslems scholars who believe that the prophecies in Deuteronomy, Isaiah and others were all about Muhammad. Their arguments are very convincing and very comforting to people who believe that the only way to paradise is through Muhammad.

In all your quotations you had to insert Jesus in paranthesis. Anyone can insert anybody’s name. If I believed in you, Angel, I could quote Hebrews 1:2 as follows: “Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son (ANGEL FRAIJO), whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds”?

Anybody can interpret the past in any way they want, but NOBODY can predict the future. John claims that Moses was talking about Jesus, but did Moses say that? NO! John claims that Jesus was there from the beginning. But does Genesis say that? NO. And on and on. The New Testament talks about Jesus but the Old Testament DOES NOT.

I asked you if can find the name Jesus just once in the entire OT. Have you?

Well, you are not going to admit to that. It would be too discomforting for you. Religion is all about comfort - not much about faith, and clearly not at all about truth. And religion is local - if you were born and raised a Mormon, chances are you would be convinced that Jesus came to America; if you were born and raised in India, chances are you would be defending your Hindu beliefs; etc. etc. Faith is usually not a friend of truth.

Personally, I find my comfort in knowing that I am not fooling myself.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/23/2011 14:40 pm

charles: the bible is all about JESUS from beginning to end. how do you explain these scriptures then.

Hebrews 1:2
2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son ( JESUS ), whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

Colossians 1:16-17
16 For by him ( JESUS ) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

John 1-2
1 In the beginning was the Word ( JESUS ), and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2 The same was in the beginning with God.
3 All things were made by him (JESUS ); and without him was not any thing made that was made.

John 1:10
10 He ( JESUS ) was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

John 1:14-15
14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
15 John ( the baptist ) bare witness of him ( JESUS ), and cried, saying, This was he of whom I spake, He that cometh after me is preferred before me: for he was before me.

Who are they all talking about? They are all talking about JESUS charles. And please; stop posting what man thinks because it’s all theories and opinions. There is no factual truth and if you say there is; that is being a hypocrite; even to what you base your knowledge on. For even in high school one learns that everything we discover or base our opinions/theories/hypothesis on is never really concrete evidence because nothing is ever open/shut. I already know what you’re gonna say but here is just a small example of that theory of yours and how it works. There is a room full of scientists standing in a circle; one leans over and whispers so no one can hear; and then this scientist leans over and begins to whisper what the first scientist says. Now this continues until it finally reaches the scientist who started it all. A totally different message. This is NOT GOD’S WAY. If GOD is DIVINELY PERFECT he never makes a mistake ever and GOD NEVER HAS. If you say he has then GOD IS NOT GOD. Yet you keep limiting GOD in every way. And please charles don’t post that everyone who wrote the bible is false as well because they are not.

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/23/2011 07:58 am

Hi Angel, you wrote about heeding individuals instead of heeding God. You said, for example, “We can quote many individual’s throughout history who claim to have an insight or understanding instead of HEEDING WHAT GOD SAYS AND SHOWS US.”

Well, Angel, I agree. Throughout history people like Moses, Zoroaster, Isaiah, Gautama, Jesus, Paul, Muhammad, and Harold Camping, just to mention a few, claimed to have an “insight or understanding”, as you said. When we read the Bible or any other holy book and quote these men we are not in touch with the real God. How can we reach God through men that send us different messages? To reach God we have to bypass all these men and connect directly with God spiritually.

With regard to Jesus being or not being in the OT, just read the entire OT and tell me if you find his name anywhere. You quoted a bunch of Bible excerpts, some of them from the OT. Sure enough, none of the OT passages you quoted mention Jesus. I have no idea why you took the trouble to list them. Again, please tell me if you find the word Jesus ANYWHERE in the OT.

As I said in my previous posting, NT authors tried very hard to link Jesus to the OT but in so doing only contradicted themselves. None of these NT claims holds up against cross-examination. I gave you two examples of this. I’ll give you more if you need.

For example one of the most popular claims is that the author of John claimed that John claimed that Jesus claimed that Moses wrote about him, and Bible apologists tried this to a Deuteronomy excerpt which predicts that a future prophet will be raised.

Okay, let’s look at the facts:
1. First of all, do we know for sure that Moses wrote Deuteronomny? No, we don’t. Moses actually died before Deuteronomy was finished.
2. Do we know which future prophet the author was talking about? No we don’t. Joshua is the most likely answer because he is the one that succeeded Moses. But it could also be any of the prophets that followed: Jeremiah, Daniel, Hosea, Malachi, Muhammad… any of these and more.
3. Didn’t the author talk about a future prophet? One that had yet to be raised? Yes, he did. If you believe that Jesus was with God from the beginning, then he couldn’t have been this future prophet yet to be raised, could he?
So, you see, this is just one of those attempts to link Jesus to the OT that fall on their face upon cross-examination.

Jesus is never mentioned in the OT. That’s a fact.
Jesus never wrote one single word of the Bible. That’s another fact.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/21/2011 21:41 pm

Here is a little something to think about charles.

Every man’s opinion and theory will and shall always fall and fail cross examination by any man but GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD shall always stand as truth even when all is said and done for GOD has ordained it before all creation.

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/21/2011 19:15 pm

hey charles: hope all is well with you today and that GOD BLESSES YOU ALWAYS. Well here is a little history on myself. I am 37, a daddy of 2, and was once as worldly as could be till I had my GOD experience. Never wanted to know GOD or deal with him in any way. Thank GOD he knows better than I do. I am not from a religious family my only knowledge was what I was taught in school, t.v., the world, and man’s own illusions. I am a big fan of the rangers and braves. Ryan and Glavine are the all time best pitcher’s ever. ( my opinion of course ) I have a question for you? Why is it instead of relying on GOD; we as humans rely on what man says and believes he knows and discovered. We can quote many individual’s throughout history who claim to have an insight or understanding instead of HEEDING WHAT GOD SAYS AND SHOWS US. We rely so much more on man’s opinions of GOD. No matter how smart or educated one may be his knowledge came from another man’s opinion or theory. For as far as i know theories and opinions have the same meanings. If the bible says that man’s thoughts are not of GOD’S and that GOD’S thoughts are not of us and we can never understand someone who can see from beginning to end; why then do we rely on ourselves and on our own works if all we ever do is come up with opinions like every other man. We need to STOP TRYING TO DISPROVE THE BIBLE AND LET GOD REVEAL IT TO US. For we will always wander around in our own mess we create and wander astray from GOD. Sorry this is off the subject but this lays on my heart and it hurts me so. I see so many brothers and sisters in JESUS CHRIST fall to the wayside with so many questions of disbelief because they never really ever became anchored in GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD. Or they never truly had a GOD EXPERIENCE. Or they saw a show, read a book, went to a seminar, or even heard from someone in their own church that triggered their own questionings. You said JESUS was never in old testament then please fully explain these scriptures because as you can see word for word from new testament back into old testament. Once again confirming Isaiah 28:10. SORRY SO LONG. GOD BLESS YOU TODAY CHARLES.

Acts 3:18-24
18 But those things, which God before had shewed by the mouth of all his prophets, that Christ should suffer, he hath so fulfilled.
19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.
20 And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you:
21 Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.
22 For Moses truly said unto the fathers, A prophet shall the Lord your God raise up unto you of your brethren, like unto me; him shall ye hear in all things whatsoever he shall say unto you.
23 And it shall come to pass, that every soul, which will not hear that prophet, shall be destroyed from among the people.
24 Yea, and all the prophets from Samuel and those that follow after, as many as have spoken, have likewise foretold of these days.

Now as for Luke 4:17-21 is found in Isaiah 61:1-2

Luke 4:17-21
17 And there was delivered unto him the book of the prophet Esaias. And when he had opened the book, he found the place where it was written,
18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he hath sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the captives, and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at liberty them that are bruised,
19 To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
20 And he closed the book, and he gave it again to the minister, and sat down. And the eyes of all them that were in the synagogue were fastened on him.
21 And he began to say unto them, This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears.

Isaiah 61
1 The Spirit of the Lord GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he hath sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound;
2 To proclaim the acceptable year of the LORD, and the day of vengeance of our God; to comfort all that mourn;

Now for Acts 13:27-29 is found Psalm 22

Acts 13:27-28
27 For they that dwell at Jerusalem, and their rulers, because they knew him not, nor yet the voices of the prophets which are read every sabbath day, they have fulfilled them in condemning him.
28 And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain.
29 And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre.

Psalm 22
1 My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? why art thou so far from helping me, and from the words of my roaring?
2 O my God, I cry in the day time, but thou hearest not; and in the night season, and am not silent.
3 But thou art holy, O thou that inhabitest the praises of Israel.
4 Our fathers trusted in thee: they trusted, and thou didst deliver them.
5 They cried unto thee, and were delivered: they trusted in thee, and were not confounded.
6 But I am a worm, and no man; a reproach of men, and despised of the people.
7 All they that see me laugh me to scorn: they shoot out the lip, they shake the head, saying,
8 He trusted on the LORD that he would deliver him: let him deliver him, seeing he delighted in him.
9 But thou art he that took me out of the womb: thou didst make me hope when I was upon my mother’s breasts.
10 I was cast upon thee from the womb: thou art my God from my mother’s belly.
11 Be not far from me; for trouble is near; for there is none to help.
12 Many bulls have compassed me: strong bulls of Bashan have beset me round.
13 They gaped upon me with their mouths, as a ravening and a roaring lion.
14 I am poured out like water, and all my bones are out of joint: my heart is like wax; it is melted in the midst of my bowels.
15 My strength is dried up like a potsherd; and my tongue cleaveth to my jaws; and thou hast brought me into the dust of death.
16 For dogs have compassed me: the assembly of the wicked have inclosed me: they pierced my hands and my feet.
17 I may tell all my bones: they look and stare upon me.
18 They part my garments among them, and cast lots upon my vesture.
19 But be not thou far from me, O LORD: O my strength, haste thee to help me.
20 Deliver my soul from the sword; my darling from the power of the dog.
21 Save me from the lion’s mouth: for thou hast heard me from the horns of the unicorns.
22 I will declare thy name unto my brethren: in the midst of the congregation will I praise thee.
23 Ye that fear the LORD, praise him; all ye the seed of Jacob, glorify him; and fear him, all ye the seed of Israel.
24 For he hath not despised nor abhorred the affliction of the afflicted; neither hath he hid his face from him; but when he cried unto him, he heard.
25 My praise shall be of thee in the great congregation: I will pay my vows before them that fear him.
26 The meek shall eat and be satisfied: they shall praise the LORD that seek him: your heart shall live for ever.
27 All the ends of the world shall remember and turn unto the LORD: and all the kindreds of the nations shall worship before thee.
28 For the kingdom is the LORD’s: and he is the governor among the nations.
29 All they that be fat upon earth shall eat and worship: all they that go down to the dust shall bow before him: and none can keep alive his own soul.
30 A seed shall serve him; it shall be accounted to the Lord for a generation.
31 They shall come, and shall declare his righteousness unto a people that shall be born, that he hath done this.

Now for Hebrews 10:7 is found in Psalm 40:6-8

Hebrews 10:7
7 Then said I, Lo, I come (in the volume of the book it is written of me,) to do thy will, O God.

Psalm 40:6-8
6 Sacrifice and offering thou didst not desire; mine ears hast thou opened: burnt offering and sin offering hast thou not required.
7 Then said I, Lo, I come: in the volume of the book it is written of me,
8 I delight to do thy will, O my God: yea, thy law is within my heart.

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/21/2011 19:08 pm

Hey Angel, I am glad you did not take offense and thanks for organizing you thoughts in paragraphs. I can follow you much better now.

Okay, we are of course miles apart in what we believe and why, but I can understand you perfectly because I was once in your shoes. I had a religious upbringing and the Bible was my life. I was even on my way to becoming a Catholic priest. When I first started noticing some obvious inconsistencies in the Bible I was only too eager to dismiss them in the same way you are doing. But the more I studied the Bible the more I realized how imperfect it is and I couldn’t keep defending it with a clear conscience. At that point the phrase “The truth shall set you free” took on a whole new meaning for me.

This is not about changing anybody’s opinions but only about expressing them. The only thing I can hope for is that we can at least agree on SOME of the facts.

Fact: Jesus did not write one single word of the Bible. When you quote Luke 4:21 you are quoting Luke, not Jesus. Now, you might ask, why would Luke put words in Jesus’ mouth? He had a very strong reason to do that. The main purpose for most of the NT was to convince Jews and Gentiles that Jesus was the messiah of the OT. The people were not ready for a new religion. They would only accept Jesus if he was a continuation of their traditions. So that’s what Paul, Luke and others tried to do.

Now when you try to prove something that isn’t true, you know that your testimony is not likely to stand up to cross-examination. That’s what happened to Luke and others. I can give you at least two instances where Luke’s testimony is contradicted by fellow evangelist Matthew:
1. The genealogy of Jesus that Luke gives in chapter three is vastly different from the one that Matthew starts his gospel with.
2. Luke 2:2 places the birth of Jesus in the year 6 C.E. (during the time of the census of Cyrenius) while Matthew tells us the more likely story that Jesus was born during the reign of Herod, who died ten years before the census.
(You said it’s impossible for the Bible to contradict itself, but I just gave you two examples).

You mentioned several other passages in the NT, and my response would be similar. But, rather than jumping all over the Bible in super-long comments, take me to each of them in their appropriate verses and I will be glad to discuss them there.

By the way, which OT prophecies do these quotations you made refer to:
-Luke 4:21?
-Acts 13:29?
-Hebrews 10:7?

With regard to my term “progressive revelation concept” I was just referring to where you said in post 30 “where one verse leads u to another for a further understanding and revelation” of God’s word. In post 31 I believe I explained why a verse by Moses couldn’t possibly lead to a verse written 1,600 years later by John. This is just another example of an attempt to link Jesus to the OT when in fact the OT doesn’t give Jesus one single mention!

You also mentioned Noah and, again, I invite you to discuss this in its proper place in the Bible. There are already several comments starting with Gen. 6:13.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/20/2011 13:42 pm

hey charles… sorry about the way I write for I am not an educated man. I usually type in capital letters all the time, write in capital letters, and yes i know friends always tell me I am shouting but I just like the way it looks. So this is something I am trying to learn not to do and also I am a long wind talker as you have noticed and I do shorten words I say so I can save space and so I don’t lose my train of thought. For I am a one finger typer. Slow and Steady.

Now you say JESUS is not found in the Old Testament. Then please explain what JESUS himself said in Luke 4:17-21 ( verse 21: And he(JESUS) began to say unto them,This day is this scripture fulfilled in your ears. ) Just like I said about Isaiah 28:10 says about the bible ( For precept must be upon precept, precept upon precept, line upon line, line upon line; here a little, and there a little. ) Also what does Acts 13:29 mean,
( And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre. ) So what was written of him? Also, most importantly Hebrew 10:7 which states ( Then said I, Lo, I come ( in the volume of the book it is written of me, ) to do thy will, O GOD. ) Now this is JESUS speaking is it not? Once again what was written of him that was fulfilled? Also was it not JESUS who said in Matthew 8:58 ( Verily, Verily, I say unto you, before Abraham was, I am. ) Also what does JESUS mean in John 17:5 which says ( And now O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with with the glory which I had with thee before the world was. ) Now this was JESUS speaking was it not? Saying before creation I was? Also what about Romans 15:4 which says ( For whatsoever things were written aforetime were written for our learning, that we through patience and comfort of the scriptures might have hope. ) There are so many scriptures in new and old testament showing and speaking of JESUS CHRIST. Is JESUS not the alpha and the omega. The beginning and the ending. Which is, which was, and which is to come, the Almighty. A direct scripture from JESUS himself in Revelation 1:8. Also explain Hebrew 13:8 which says and goes with Revelations 1:8 ( Hebrew 13:8: JESUS CHRIST the same yesterday, and today, and forever. )

Now You said the bible contradicts itself which is entirely impossible because GOD wrote the bible and not man at all. Look at these 3 scriptures and explain them for these are GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD and not mine or any man. Lets look at 2 Timothy 3:16 which says ( All scripture is given by inspiration of GOD, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof( means to examine and study for yourself), for correction(means to check and correct oneself daily to live by GOD’S WORD), for instruction in righteousness:( means to hear and obey GOD’S WILL. ) Please, also explain 2 Peter 1:20-21 which says (Knowing this first, that no prophecy of the scripture is of any private interpretation. For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man; but holy men of GOD spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost. ) Now the most important scripture is Revelation 22:18-19 which says ( For I testify unto every man that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book, If any man shall add unto these things, GOD shall add unto him the plagues that are written in this book. And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, GOD shall take away his part out of the book of life, and from the things which are written in this book. ) Sounds pretty much that this bible is GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD. Perfect from beginning to ending. If these scriptures aren’t enough I will send you more if need be.

Also I have no clue what progressive revelation concept is or means. All i know is GOD’S WORD and I let him reveal it unto me according to GOD’S WORD. Also I had no clue what prejudicial meant. Had to look it up. HaHaHa I crack myself up a lot and no I am not prejudicial in anyway shape or form. That goes against GOD’S WORD. Also the world has no excuse of the TRUTH OF GOD and all has been provided so there is no excuse and we will all answer for it. So to say we are all believers and non-believers is a self justification just because there are so many different beliefs. But there is only one true GOD along with all his teachings. Look at JESUS. He was among the Pharisee’s, Scribes, Sadducees, Theologians,etc,etc. and not one would try to understand or study his teachings and they couldn’t even agree among themselves. An as for Noah, search the history of Noah’s 3 sons and were they went and what nations came forth from them. You will see Gentiles, Jews, Samaritans. Where all the races of this day and time stem from. Remember after the flood only Noah and his sons and their wives were the only people in the world. An as for Moses time well if you remember none of them made it to the Promise Land. Only Joshua and Caleb. Boy I guess all those others really understood GOD’S WORD because if they did they wouldn’t of needed Moses. Once again I’m sorry for this long comment but GOD’S WORD is forever and ever for all eternity. We will never know it all or understand all of it. For it has no beginning and no ending in wisdom, knowledge, or understanding of GOD’S WORD. LIMITLESS just like GOD.

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/20/2011 08:15 am

Angel, thanks for post 30 but, as much as I hate critisizing anybody’s writing style, I have to confess I had an extremely hard time reading it. First, it was way too long. Secondly, it was full of SHOUTING words; you alternated between regular and block lettering so frequently that you made my eyes dizzy. Thirdly, please try to use regular words instead of all that shorthand; this isn’t texting. And, finally, please observe paragraphing and punctuation rules. You ran your entire blockbuster as one sentence!

Having said that, let me try to address some of the things you said. You said I can’t argue with the three classes of people you came up. 1. Yes I sure can argue, and 2. I don’t understand how you got that from the Bible. Anybody can classify anything, and yours seem to be especially prejudicial. I am not going to spend much time on this, but let me just make one point: we are ALL believers and we are ALL non-believers. One who doesn’t believe in the Bible is as much a nonbeliever as one who doesn’t believe in the Vedas or the Quran or the Atheistic way of thinking (or as one who doesn’t believe that the Rangers are going to win the World Series!) Using the term in only one sense is discriminatory.

Next, I absolutely can’t accept the progressive revelation concept. 1 John does not explain Genesis. The first people to read Genesis 3,500 years ago did not have to wait 1,600 years for 1 John to understand what Moses had told them! What holy sense does that make? The Bible is definitely not woven like a blanket but rather a hodgepodge of topics, languages, styles and purposes. So much so that many books contradict each other.

In general, I can tell you that none of the NT attempts to link Jesus to the OT don’t have any legs to stand on. We can discuss each of them separately, under their appropriate verses, if you want.

I’ll stop here because this is getting too long. Please keep your comments brief and to the point. I hope you take my criticism the right way.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/20/2011 01:12 am

to charles: i’m not going to tell u that u r wrong but instead show u ” y ” as u so desire the truth of GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD. see we seek the truth’s cause it’s already in us if u r TRULY BORN AGAIN OF THE SPIRIT… but here is the problem we r flesh and like always… as proven throughout the bible we are a perverse creature born from iniquity and will deny GOD’S TRUTH and lower GOD to our means and understandings so that we may feel JUSTIFIED… REMEMBER THE TRUTH IS A DOUBLE EDGE SWORD THAT CUTS RIGHT TO THE HEART, MIND AND SOUL… for u see the bible is a REVELATION… revealed through the HOLY SPIRIT… this is stated throughout old n new testament… especially by apostle paul… also of JESUS HIMSELF… now here is the ” y ” u seek… we must first get ourselves COMPLETELY OUT OF THE WAY N LET THE HOLY SPIRIT DIRECT N GUIDE US TO THE TRUTH… now here is the truth of all this…there r 3 classes of people in this world according to GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD…
( 1. ) bride/predestined/church with oil/elected/those truly born into the church of CHRIST which is a SPIRITUAL CHURCH/SUPERNATURAL CHURCH/royal seed/GOD’S SEED
( 2. ) church with no oil/organized doctrines/seeds with no HOLY SPIRIT
( 3. ) non-believers/pagans/satan’s seed
now u can’t argue with that because it is shown in the story of noah’s 3 sons… that is another story as well… now ask urself this… do u believe the bible is GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD that NEVER FAILS and is WOVEN TOGETHER LIKE A BLANKET… if yes here is the scripture to prove it… isaiah 28:10…u see GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD… now do u understand SCRIPTURE RUNNING/CONTEXTS… u know where one verse leads u to another for a further understanding and revelation of GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD… ok now on to genesis 3:1-24 and ( genesis 4:1-24 and genesis 5:1-32 )… now the serpent was never a snake or cold blooded creature/reptile… he was a mammal/like man on earth/beast of the field… mammal means a warm blooded/vertebrate/where the females create milk through mammary glands to nourish their young/four chambered heart n lungs which r separated by a diaphragm from the other organs within the body/etc… now in genesis 3 we find this out about the serpent… he was able to speak/understand/was very intelligent/was very attractive… and now u ready for this… serpent looked and acted like man but had no life in him for he was a warm blooded/vertebrate animal… and he deceived eve with his false teachings of GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD… did u notice the serpent knew GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD… now the apple WAS NOT the fall of EVERYTHING… SEX WAS… THIS IS THE FIRST N ORIGINAL SIN… how u ask… read 1 john 2:16 to understand genesis 3:6 lust of the eyes for the flesh of man/woman… now lets continue on to genesis 3:15 where GOD PUTS ENMITY BETWEEN THY SEED (SATAN/SERPENT’S SEEDS) N HER SEED (GOD’S SEED/JESUS) N HER SEED SHALL BRUISE THY HEAD (SATAN/SERPENT’S SEED) N THOU (SATAN/SERPENT’S SEED) SHALL BRUISE HIS HEEL (GOD’S SEED/JESUS)… u see satan entered into the serpent that looked like man and possessed him and spoke to eve ‘for no one else knew the WORD OF GOD at that time besides GOD/adam/eve… n satan… remember the great battle n fall from heaven… n y it happened… if u don’t believe this then explain these scriptures… isaiah 14:12-14… ezekiel 28:12-19… revelation 12:7-17… explain these scriptures to me then… especially ezekiel 28:12-19… how could tyre be in the garden of eden… it wasn’t tyre but satan… now back to genesis 3:15… to serpent’s seed… if you run the scriptures/contexts it leads u to john 8:44… also read 1 john 3:8-12… there u have serpent’s seed/satan’s seed ( children )… now her seed… GOD’S SEED ( CHILDREN )/JESUS… run the scriptures/contexts which leads u to isaiah 7:14… also read it fulfilled in matthew 1:23… u see this is GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD WHICH NEVER FAILS… isn’t it said in the bible that EVERYTHING IN THIS WORLD SHALL PASS N BE DESTROYED EXCEPT FOR GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD WHICH LIVES FOR ALL ETERNITY… now back to genesis 3:15… about the bruising… once again run the scriptures/contexts which leads u to romans 16:20… U SEE THE WORD OF GOD NEVER FAILS… so cain is serpents seed/ satan’s children and abel is GOD’S CHILDREN… that is y genesis 4 is cain’s seed… which is satan’s/serpent’s seed… n genesis 5 is GOD’S CHILDREN… GOD is showing us a division between the two separate seeds… since the garden even until now… remember the three classes of people… GOD NEVER CHANGES… HE IS ALWAYS PERFECT…IN ALL THINGS… now u have ur ” Y ” n GOD’S HOLY LIVING WORD according to GOD AND NOT MAN… so now u have to decide as everyone else throughout time… to either accept GOD’S TRUTH or like everyone else… WHICH WOULD BE TO MISS THE VERY MESSAGE OF THIS HOUR… as shown throughout the bible… BECAUSE NOW U HAVE THE TRUTH N GOD WILL HOLD U TO THIS TRUTH FOR U CAN NOT DENY GOD’S WORD… N SAY U NEVER KNEW… for this moment will be placed before u again before GOD… GOD BLESS U ALL ALWAYS!!!

By angel fraijo (wrote 240 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 10/19/2011 23:10 pm

Charles: Well, that is good, your SENSES are “tingling”…there is in you that sense, that hunger for THE TRUTH! There is in you that longing for something more sensible than all the senselessness of life now…there is in you that something that is reaching out for eternity- you wants to be ETERNAL…for deep in you you cannot believe that one such as you which think, laughs, cry and experience all of these will end up to nothing. CONGRATULATION you are seeking for the TRUTH!

“Seek ye first the kingdom…seek and ye shall find…knock and it shall be opened ..”these are all promises in the Word of God which you should claim as your own treasured Words to lead you to the Truth. Jesus promised:

‘If ye may remain in my word, truly my disciples ye are, and ye shall know the truth and the truth will set you free! John 8:31.

In each of our heart is the longing for that which is eternal, God put it in there so we might seek HIM THE ETERNAL:

Ecclesiastes 3:11 He has made everything beautiful in its time. He has also set eternity in the hearts of men;.

Let me share a song of Bob Dylan about the matter, this is his journey, and can learn from it , he sang:

Listen: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e-ek1ed7×3A&feature=related

In the time of my confession,
in the hour of my deepest need
When the pool of tears beneath my feet
flooded every newborn seed
There’s a dyin’ voice within me
reaching out somewhere,
Toiling in the danger and in
the morals of despair.

Don’t have the inclination to
look back on any mistake,
Like Cain,
I now behold this chain of events
that I must break.
In the fury of the moment
I can see the Master’s hand
In every leaf that trembles,
in every grain of sand.

Oh, the flowers of indulgence
and the weeds of yesteryear,
Like criminals,
they have choked the breath
of conscience and good cheer.
The sun beat down upon the steps
of time to light the way
To ease the pain of idleness
and the memory of decay.

I gaze into the doorway of
temptation’s angry flame
And every time I pass that way
I always hear my name.
Then onward in my journey
I come to understand
That every hair is numbered
like every grain of sand.

I have gone from rags to riches
in the sorrow of the night
In the violence of a summer’s dream,
in the chill of a wintry light,
In the bitter dance of loneliness
fading into space,
In the broken mirror of innocence
on each forgotten face.

I hear the ancient footsteps like
the motion of the sea
Sometimes I turn, there’s someone there,
other times it’s only me.
I am hanging in the balance
of the reality of man
Like every sparrow falling,
like every grain of sand.

By TIUCHE (wrote 2759 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/17/2011 13:32 pm

TIUCHE, the Bible is a set of books. Some are sharp. Some are beautiful. Some seem to be factual. And some seem to be nonsense. I am capable of treating each book, each chapter, each verse with an open mind. As a self-proclaimed apologist, you cannot do that.

Still, I applaud you for being here… as long as you can accept - no, I know you won’t accept, but, at least, TOLERATE - different opinions. Defend the Bible as fervently as you want, but respect the opinions of others. If I ever fail to respect your or anybody else’s opinions, I sincerely apologize.

I came here in an attempt to save my faith. I wanted people to tell me that I was wrong, and why I was wrong. I had this sincere need of being convinced that God is really good, that heaven does exist, and so on and so forth. I certainly found many people telling me I was wrong, but nobody could tell me WHY.

So, rather than saving my faith, my participation here may further imperil it. But that is not necessarily a bad thing. The truth is not always what we want it to be and I’d much rather face an inconvenient truth than live a warm, fuzzy and delusive existence. This is a learning experience, which is a good thing, and I intend to stay here. The ability to reason things out openly is liberating. Besidesw I recognize that, despite all its flaws, a disporportionate number of people in this country swear by the Bible and that in itself makes it an important piece of our library that I cannot ignore.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/17/2011 12:30 pm

Charles: Yeah I am not ashamed of God Word, I am here for God, I rely on His Sure Words!
Mark 8:38 If anyone is ashamed of me and my words in this adulterous and sinful generation, the Son of Man will be ashamed of him when he comes in his Father’s glory.

Why waste your time debating on THE WORD when you can spend your time in pursuit of pleasures…you got but a short time (36,500 days less your age right now)…there is not even a thousand who liked this site; so why waste your precious time?

But if you are here for the truth, go on debate…someday the SHARPNESS OF GOD’S WORD would convince you that indeed the Bible is SHARP…sharper than your mind!

By TIUCHE (wrote 2759 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/17/2011 09:47 am

Re Post 25. TIUCHE wrote “You are the one who is unreasonable.I am here for God while you are here for yourself..” I know what that means, TIUCHE. That means that even when you know you’re wrong you’re not going to admit it. I ahve no chance keeping YOU honest.

And, TIUCHE, you are ignorant of the meaning of the word ignorant. It means “lacking knowledge, uninformed, unaware.” It has nothing to do with ignore. You should look things up before you write them down. But, again, you’re not here for what’s right. You are here for God!!

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/17/2011 03:30 am

Charles:LOL!You posted:TIUCHE, TIUCHE!!! Your two answers didn’t really answer anything! My first point had been that God’s command to Adam was unreasonable. God was trying to teach him about good and evil by denying him access to good and evil! Now, what sense does that make?

My answer: You are the one who is unreasonable.I am here for God while you are here for yourself..who between us is unreasonable is plain to see. iMAGINE A MERE MAN trying to tell everyone that God’s command to Adam was unreasonable and at the same time you agreed that God Standard ought to be followed…you own thoughts contradict.

Again you said: My second point was that, contrary to what you tried to imply, Jesus never talked about the original sin. All you said about this was that Adam and Eve were ignorant. Just FYI there isn’t that much difference between ignorant and innocent. Being innocent means being ignorant through no fault of your own.

My Answer: We have talk about original sin in Genesis and you forgot my stand… Being ignorant is different from being innocent…don’t you see the words IGNORE in it? Like what you are doing right now IGNORING WORDS because you think they are unimportant. It is up to you, hear the Word of the Lord:

Proverbs 18:21 The tongue has the power of life and death, and those who love it will eat its fruit.

Matthew 12:36 But I tell you that men will have to give account on the day of judgment for every careless word they have spoken.For by your words you will be acquitted, and by your words you will be condemned.”

By TIUCHE (wrote 2759 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/17/2011 02:27 am

TIUCHE, TIUCHE!!! Your two answers didn’t really answer anything! My first point had been that God’s command to Adam was unreasonable. God was trying to teach him about good and evil by denying him access to good and evil! Now, what sense does that make? All you did in your psuedo response was lecture me about righteousness and foolishness and whatever. I will let you wallow in your self-aggrandizement. You obviously think you are “with the Spirit”. I guess God has a special place for you at his other right hand or something.

My second point was that, contrary to what you tried to imply, Jesus never talked about the original sin. All you said about this was that Adam and Eve were ignorant. Just FYI there isn’t that much difference between ignorant and innocent. Being innocent means being ignorant through no fault of your own.

How about that for a tango?

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 19:30 pm

CARLOS errr charles yeah you and rolando should dance the Tango…with the tune of LAMBADA! An unbeliever and a babe…strange semblance…have some character in common!

You said:I need to keep you honest with yourself here because this is NOT AT ALL simple to understand! If God told Adam and Eve not to fight or not to kill or not to do anything that a human mind might understand is bad, then, yes, it would have been simple to understand. But telling them not to eat fruit or not to eat knowledge (sic) or whichever way you want to phrase it is truly, TRULY absurd.

My answer: I Corinthians 2:14, NIV. “The man without the Spirit does not accept the things that come from the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him, and he cannot understand them, because they are spiritually discerned.”You call God a God but you donot at all treat Him as a God, you want to judge Him! You are better than God? More righteous? What pride you have. You don’t believe in God…but you pretend to believe in Him…

And regarding my post that“Jesus came to bring us back into God’s Kingdom & its blessings; He came to write and put in our hearts God’s Standard on what is good and evil…telling us to repent of the rebellion against God’s Government.” You went against it by saying: This is all true but you are trying to mislead us, because Jesus was NOT talking about Adam and Eve’s sin or “rebellion”. Jesus was talking about REAL sins. What Adam and Eve did was no sin and no rebellion. It was innocent, childlike curiosity.

My answer: Adam and Eve were not innocent but ignorant. They were told what to do and what not to do. By ignoring the instructions of God they became IGNORANT! IGNORANCE OF THE LAW EXCUSES NO ONE.

IGNORANCE IS NOT INNOCENCE BUT SIN.-Robert Browning.

By TIUCHE (wrote 2759 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 17:38 pm

Re Posts 19 and 20. TIUCHE, you said “Our first parents were punished not for eating an apple but for eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. This is just simple to understand but man alienated from the Word of God invents all kinds of interpretation until they themselves think this TRUE story as absurd.”

I need to keep you honest with yourself here because this is NOT AT ALL simple to understand! If God told Adam and Eve not to fight or not to kill or not to do anything that a human mind might understand is bad, then, yes, it would have been simple to understand. But telling them not to eat fruit or not to eat knowledge (sic) or whichever way you want to phrase it is truly, TRULY absurd.

And then you said “Jesus came to bring us back into God’s Kingdom & its blessings; He came to write and put in our hearts God’s Standard on what is good and evil…telling us to repent of the rebellion against God’s Government.” This is all true but you are trying to mislead us, because Jesus was NOT talking about Adam and Eve’s sin or “rebellion”. Jesus was talking about REAL sins. What Adam and Eve did was no sin and no rebellion. It was innocent, childlike curiosity.

Which puts me in agreement with Roland G’s Post 20.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 14:17 pm

La Niño Roland G. There you go again with your lambada…never thinking before saying. Your just confuse and drunk…think deeper what i am saying. If you cannot get what i mean sorry…drink your milk…grow up!

By TIUCHE (wrote 2759 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 13:32 pm

Senor Tiuche (Post #19): 2. THEY DECIDED FOR THEMSELVES WHAT IS GOOD AND EVIL..”

Adam and Eve did not have knowledge of good and evil. So, they cannot decide for themselves what is good and evil. Before the fall, neither Adam nor Eve knew that disobeying God’s command was evil.

By Roland G (wrote 1416 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 13:20 pm

ADAM & EVE WERE PUNISHED FOR DISOBEYING THE WORD OF GOD and deciding for themselves what is right and wrong…for there should only one who should say what is right and wrong-GOD not angels nor humans!

Our first parents were punished not for eating an apple but for eating the fruit of the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. This is just simple to understand but man alienated from the Word of God invents all kinds of interpretation until they themselves think this TRUE story as absurd.

What is the tree of the knowledge of good and evil…it is WHAT IT WAS CALLED- THE TREE OR THE BRANCH OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF GOOD AND EVIL or the hierarchical data structure of what is Good and Evil.

Our first parents Eating of the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil symbolized two acts of serious rebellion against their creator:

1. THEY DISOBEYED THE WORD OF GOD or GOD HIMSELF, and
2. THEY DECIDED FOR THEMSELVES WHAT IS GOOD AND EVIL..

With these acts they decided not anymore to listen & obey the Standard of God. They decided to think for themselves to form their own standard for what is right and wrong, for what is good and evil. They rejected the Government of God…therefore they were banished as rebels…they followed the beast of old-the serpent!

Jesus came to bring us back into God’s Kingdom & its blessings;He came to write and put in our hearts God’s Standard on what is good and evil…telling us to repent of the rebellion against God’s Government.

By TIUCHE (wrote 2759 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 12:27 pm

When I was a little kid I always wondered what the real meaning of Adam and Eve’s sin was. Surely, I reasoned with my little mind, God would not punish Adam and Eve and all the people of the world for eating an apple! My mother was always after me to eat my apples. Apples are a wholesome thing to eat! I was sure I was receiving the children’s version of the story and that when I grew up I would find out that the real sin had something to do with things that only adults can talk about.

So then I started getting the explanation that it wasn’t an apple, but knowledge! God forbade Adam and Eve from eating out of the tree of knowledge. But wasn’t knowledge also good? Wasn’t that the reason why I was going to school - to gain knowledge? Why would God punish everybody simply because we wanted to know?

Now, in my old age, I hear all these juicy stories about Eve having sex with the devil or with an animal (finally, some adult talk!) and all the other crazy theories about Israelites being the descendants of Satan (was Jesus born from a line of devils?) and so on. I must admit this discussion has been entertaining. I am sorry I got into it so late.

But I have to say one thing. As crazy as all these theories are, they are not nearly as far-fetched as the original apple story. People punished for eating an apple! No, I could not believe that when I was six years old and I cannot for a moment believe it now.

By Charles (wrote 1421 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 9/16/2011 02:23 am

pleasant to the eyes the acts 9;9-judges 14;1-we are not in the fleshly eyes for the eyes of the lord in the heart

By -ovetdurano@yahoo.com (wrote 7 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 7/25/2010 03:40 am

Yes,Nana, you are right; for the next verse 7 states, “Then the eyes of BOTH OF THEM were opened, and they knew that they were naked.”

By Jayant Christian (wrote 287 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/6/2010 08:23 am

Can some one help to explain Genesis3:6 again? Check this…..and gave also unto her HUSBAND WITH HER; and he did eat.Was Adam standing by her when she was being tempted?

By Nana Yaw (wrote 1 Bible Commentary - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/4/2010 11:38 am

Yeah, my comments at#10 and 11 are to be taken together. The doctrine of satan’s seed gives way to all sorts of racial thinking, as some comments will show. What I have tried to show that there is no room for racial diferences in Jesus Christ and His gospel.

By Jayant Christian (wrote 287 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 2/3/2010 08:22 am

oh, nm, just looked at the rest of the thread. my bad

By Jason W. Elder (wrote 314 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 2/3/2010 02:25 am

How does that relate to Gen 3:6?

By Jason W. Elder (wrote 314 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 2/3/2010 02:24 am

Now there are no racial differncec in Jesus Christ.

We now know ALL men in Christ and not outwordly. They that are in Christ Jesus are New creation!

(References: Roman 3:23; 3:11-18; 1 Timothy 2:6; 1Cor 5:14-17;Gal. 3:28; Col. 3:10-11)

How can we now dare to deviate from that so glorious gospel!

By Jayant Christian (wrote 287 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 2/1/2010 21:54 pm

Yeah, the word “touch” also means having sex. It is used accordingly in 1 Cor. 7: Even in my own languagae it carries the same connotation. But again, one has to see the clear context. “Who touched me,” was what Jesus asked, but there it is used in a literal sense. But when God gave the command to Adam, there was no reference to touching the fruit. Even the Satan did not tell that in initiating the conversation.

Well, I have read something about the stone of scone etc. But something else comes to my mind. It was in answer to a Macedonian call Paul got in vision that the Gospel entered in Europe. God had a plan. Britishers ruled the world. Although the British colonial administration had its poitical and economic interests. They did not always support the missionaries from Europe, but many missionaries like Adoniram Judson, William carrey, David Livingstone, Hudson etc were instrumental in taking gospel to different parts of the world. The British administration also did a lot in education and also teaching English. This one langauge did help in spreading the Gospel with translation in local langauge. So God did use the Eurpean missionaries to spread the Good news of Jesus Christ. The Gospel they took to the world says:

It is by the disobediance of one man that sin spread to ALL. ( )

ALL have sinned and come short of the glory of God. (Roman 3:23)

There is no righteous, not one, they have ALL gone astray, they are ALL filled with the venom of vipers ( )

ALL includes JEWS and non- JEWS!

But Jesus is the ransom or us ALL!

By Jayant Christian (wrote 287 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 2/1/2010 21:42 pm

Jayant,check out Genesis 3:3 the word the word touch which adam and eve were instructed not to do. The word is nah-gah in the hebrew which means to lie with someone sexually. Sex has always produced so called fruit. Cain is the fruit of satan. do you think that true Israel is there today? No. the tribes are scatarred as God’s word has said. The kenites, or sons of Cain are the ones in Isreal today. Remember jacobs pillar from Genesis? Well today it is called the stone of scone and sits underneath the coranation chair in britain. In Isaiah, the tender twigs,or daughters of hezikiah brought it there. True isreal today is american, and britian. The house of David God said shall always have a light. Where is it? certainly not in Isreal. But it is in Great britain. Do a little history. This is fact.

By shawn (wrote 9 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/31/2010 08:05 am

The defination of sin in the Bible: “The trasgression of law is sin.” Adam and Eve had disobeyed the command of God. If it is only the sin of the blood (here perhaps you mean sin of sex)that is to be atoned for by blood, then there is no propitaition for sins that are not sins of blood.The fact is that a soul that sin will die. The propitiation of sins needs death and hence there is a need for sacrifice, that is death by shedding of blood, and not a natural death.

I am learning many things from this site and many good people like you. But I think I must give expression to what little I know. Perhaps the responses to what I write will make me wise.

Yes we can read many things from the text, but it should be in the given context. We can clearly know when a word is used figuratively or otherwise. For example, when Jesus said, “you will know them by thier fruit” we know that it is used figuratively. I don’t think the word fruit is used figuratively. Moreover, it is the friut that was in the midst of the garden. All the trees in the garden was the creative work of God, not of Satan. Satan was in the form of serpent, of animal world, not of trees.

By Jayant Christian (wrote 287 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/31/2010 06:15 am

to jayant. Tree means many things in scripture. If this is a fruit tree as i believe you think it is, then why does the word mean firmness? Eve had sex with satan that is why her genitals are cursed! That is why the sacrifice must be blood, because the sin was of the blood. cain was the child of satan period! The true children of cain still to this day are in the holy land. The true israel is britian and the united states. Do a little research before opening your mouth. If fruit was the sin then fruit would be the sacrifice,not blood. It was a blood sin. Get it!

By shawn (wrote 1 Bible Commentary - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/30/2010 08:42 am

The tree giving knowledge of good and evil was already there in Eden and the Lord had forbidden to eat the fruit of it, even before the Satan went to tempt Adam and Eve. It has therefore nothing to do with the Satan genitalia of sorts and therefore it does not indicate Eve having sex with Satan.

Genesis 4:1 says that Eve concieved by Adam and gave birth to Cain How can then Cain thus not born of Satan and Abel was good.

The observation that Eve is stated to have concieved once and therfore Cain and Abel were twins has no ground either. Eve is stated to have given birth to Cain and Abel separately. It is not necessary to say every time that Eve concieved and gave birth. In fact, Adam had other sons and daughters too, and every time we don’t find the same phrase repeated. Such repetition is absurd and uncalled for. Why to interpret out of silence?

By Jayant Christian (wrote 287 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/29/2010 10:45 am

Eating a mere apple brought the curse of death upon ALL. Eve did have sex with satan. The reson this was so bad was because satan was trying to pollute the bloodline in which Christ was to come through. Look at hte meaning of the words and it is clear in hebrew we are not talking about an apple. for instance the word plesant means, a longing. People don’t have a longing for fruit. a tree to be desired. The word desire in the hebrew means, delight in. we don’t delight in fruit. the word desire can also mean lust. It is clear for those who have eyes to see

By shawn (wrote 9 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/29/2010 05:38 am

Thanks Bear. the way murray’s teachings catch on, kind of reminds me of Peter Ruckman, another man who mixes a lot of truth with a little bit of error. People say we should “Eat the meat and spit out the bones.” but a little leaven leaveneth the whole lump. And we all should be reminded that even rat poison is 99% good food.

jaysun1980@hotmail.com

By Jason W. Elder (wrote 314 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/5/2010 02:20 am

Hi, I was studying the Bible with a friend of mine that had many of Murray’s tapes and we ran across this same thing that you mentioned about Cain and Abel being twins. It is possible but the scripture does not tell us for sure. Mr. Murray calls people STUPID on his tapes and I never liked that, but my friend continued on with the doctrine. Watch out for this man! Alot of what he says makes sense and alot does not make sense. I did learn under this man about the Bible. Do your background on him because he is NOT who he says he is. He is really good at mixing false doctrine with true doctrine. I am not here to defend any one. I do not think this man is a college graduate, but this should not matter if God has called him. My Bible does NOT say that Eve had sex with the devil. Thats HIS interpretation! I had to quit studying with my friend and she had spent alot of money getting his tapes. Test the waters! Bear

By Bear (wrote 1 Bible Commentary - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 1/4/2010 05:36 am

DID EVE HAVE SEX WITH SATAN?

In Genesis 3:6 as I understand it Arnold Murray (TV preacher) teaches that the fruit which Eve ate of did not come from a tree but in reality, it was the product of satanic genitalia of sorts. In other words, Eve had sex with the serpent .I don’t know for sure that this is what Murray teaches – but I do know that some people believe along those lines.

I have heard that prostitution is the oldest profession on earth but if this doctrine is correct, prostitution takes a backseat (no pun intended) to homosexuality. I say that because whatever this fruit was, the Bible says Eve “…gave also unto her husband with her; and HE DID EAT.” (Gen 3:6)

That doesn’t sit too well with me. I know there have been homosexuals down through the ages but I find it hard to believe that Adam was the first fag and that Eve engaged in bestiality (Satan appeared as a serpent in the Garden of Eden).

As the “story” goes, after having sex with her husband and Satan, Eve conceived and bore twins whom she named Cain and Abel. That’s neither here nor there. They could have been twins because the Bible mentions Eve bearing twice but it only mentions her conceiving once. So it is “possible” but the Bible does not even hint at Cain and Abel being twins.

But this cult goes further and says that Cain was Eve’s child by Satan and Abel was hers by Adam.
…Christ wants us to understand there are plantings of God and plantings of the devil. The plantings of that wicked one began in the garden of Eden with the conception of Cain and follow down through his progeny, the Kenites. (Newsletter #195, Jan 1995. See also, #202, August 1995).

If this were true it (and it’s not) would make the possibility of them being twins even more unlikely. Not only would it violate the laws of nature, I’m fairly certain it’s a statistical/genetic improbability.

Furthermore, Eve named her firstborn son “Cain” which means “Gotten.” For she said, “I have gotten a man from the Lord.” (Gen 4:1) Now, why would Eve name him “Cain” knowing that the little bastard was the offspring of Satan? I know Eve gets picked on a lot, but do you really think she would’ve said that? I don’t think so.

Genesis 4:3 “And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.”
Now, let’s use the same logic Murray uses in previous chapter and apply it to this verse. In so doing, we have no choice but to believe that Cain brought some kind of demonic genitalia as an offering unto the Lord. (Well, no wonder God rejected his offering! I say that with a smirk on my face.)

I mean I’ve always taught and believed that if something makes literal sense not to seek any other sense. After all there’s plenty in the Bible we don’t understand. Why complicate the simple things?

But I suppose in the sex crazed culture we live in it shouldn’t surprise us that a “minister” somewhere had his mind in the gutter when he read Genesis. 2Peter 2:14 talks about these ministers “Having eyes full of adultery…” (they see sex in everything) and since we’re talking about preachers is it any wonder that the same person accuses them of “…beguiling unstable souls?”

By Jason W. Elder (wrote 314 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 7/28/2009 12:14 pm

Just Say No:
Some scholars provide three basic categories for temptation. The categories help to understand not only the temptation of Eve, but that of Jesus. (And we can read how He resisted by relying on Scripture.) The three categories are lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. These might correspond to the three evils of the flesh, the world, and the devil, and also to the trinity of man which are body, soul, and spirit. The lust of flesh was evidenced when Eve “saw that the tree was good for food”. It looked like something that would fill her belly. The lust of eyes was when Eve saw “it was pleasant to the eyes”. What is the difference between seeing fruit as good for food versus seeing it as pleasant? This particular temptation seems to relate to anticipation. It seems it will meet a need that is currently not being met. Or, it seems life will not be good until this thing is obtained. (“After a time, you may find that having is not so pleasing a thing, after all, as wanting. It is not logical, but it is often true.” Spock, Star Trek - Amok Time.) The pride of life was when Eve believed the tree was “desired to make one wise”. She wanted to be like God. Wanting to be like God is not bad itself; humans just go about it the wrong way. As with the tower at Babel, we try to lift ourselves up and make a name for ourselves. But what did God do? He came down – He humbled Himself.
Then the focus shifts to Adam. Where was he while Eve was at the tree? Did she take the fruit to him? Was he at the tree beside her the whole time? Did he know it was forbidden fruit? No clues are provided — I believe he was not at the tree, but then went through the same temptation once the fruit was presented (we just don’t have the details). (It is tradition that the fruit looked like an apple; no physical description is provided.)
One final note: Paul used this episode in his writing (1 Timothy, chapter 2). So he believed this to be an actual historical account and not myth. I think it would be foolish to support an argument with a known mythical story. That would be like me trying to argue that robots should deserve respect because Luke Skywalker was kind to C-3PO and Captain Picard gave command responsibility to Data.

By Terik Q (wrote 65 Bible Commentaries - permalink to this Commentary)
Posted on: 3/6/2009 14:51 pm